This is why we can't have nice things

Such an Aries Joined: 11 Sep 2007 Posts: 1637

I guess I need to stop going to bed around 10, these conversations go to all sorts of crazy places while I sleep.

And yes, I do believe that adopting a magickal mindset is different from the powers of positive thinking. More on that when I get home from work if people are still being civil.

Glad to see we passed through atheism in conversation already.
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' What I'm thinking in my head is, 'Well, the truth is, Brian, we can't solve global warming because I f---ing changed light bulbs in my house. It's because of something collective'.

Kitty Guardian Joined: 11 Sep 2007 Posts: 1303

Mendicant Joined: 29 Jul 2009 Posts: 167

Mod Emperor of Dune Joined: 11 Sep 2007 Posts: 3084

Such an Aries Joined: 11 Sep 2007 Posts: 1637

Alright... don't think I have the time to tackle the difference between positive thinking and a magickal state of mind in depth right now. It is hard to convince someone of a difference, really. Someone who doesn't believe in magick would consider anything related to magick that could possibly be attributed to positive thinking/self-hypnosis/whatever as caused by it.

Magickal thinking in its most basic form involves believing that when you work magick and attain your intended results, your magick caused the results. That's sort of a given, but it's important to understand that any explanation on my part could be pretty much ruled out by science. This makes sense because science is about observing events, and a magickal event is still an event that has an observable cause. We just believe that the observed cause and the magickal cause can both be "real". So, no, science will likely never find a fundamental magickal force.

Science and magick aren't really compatible. When people try to mix them, they end up sounding like asshats. People still say "energy" with reference to magick because of that nonsense. People who practice it like to seize on any popular science understanding they have to explain what is happening, but it doesn't take a scientist to realize they are badly abusing terms and meanings to try and legitimize a belief structure which shouldn't concern itself with legitimacy. Quantum physics has been recently victimized by this tendency.

Now: Why do I call myself Wiccan when I don't believe 80% of what other Wiccans say?

Wiccan is a pretty general term. Wicca has separate traditions which are their own belief systems with a couple common beliefs. Dianic is one tradition. Wicca is to Dianic Wicca as Christianity is to Roman Catholicism. Even Catholics disagree with each other. So, the difference between, say, mormonism and eastern orthodox is aproximately the same as the difference between Dianic Wicca and Seax Wicca (another tradition). I'm an eclectic Wiccan, which is a Wiccan who belongs to no particular tradition. Essentially, my beliefs are my own tradition. I find Dianic Wicca completely laughable, as well as Gardnerian Wicca, and most other traditions I am familiar with. My girlfriend and I tend to worship/practice together, and even though we agree on much we still have plenty we disagree on. She uses a wand. I do not. She prefers using ribbons and herbs for spellwork. I prefer using found items like feathers or snake skins or dumpster OJ.

Most eclectics, in my experience, hold multiple shallow and contradictory views and pretty much only add new ones instead of refining old beliefs in a search for truth. I think this is stupid. There's actually a branch of western magickal thought called Chaos Magick which involves switching your paradigms completely at will and, essentially, believing in everything when it is convenient and nothing when it is not.

Anyways, I identify as Wiccan because I follow the Wiccan Rede and believe in a pair of composite spiritual entities who symbolically represent all polarities in the universe. I identify to you as Wiccan because it is a good shorthand for what I am: a witch who has an altar with candles and stuff in his house. When I say I am Wiccan, you pretty much know what I mean and any differences between your thoughts and reality are mostly meaningless to someone on the outside.

You really shouldn't ask me questions about myself.
_________________
' What I'm thinking in my head is, 'Well, the truth is, Brian, we can't solve global warming because I f---ing changed light bulbs in my house. It's because of something collective'.

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